Linnea wrote:
It seems to go beyond what we usually identify with evil - or even greed.
It is palpable. It seems to be growing stronger each day.
dansgold wrote:
Something "not us", but something that has been with us so long that we scarcely would notice it as being foreign unless it made a misstep ... perhaps reaching too quickly for something it wanted to take from us.
And make no mistake ... it wants, it hungers ... for what exactly I don't know.
You're both talking about the same
thing here, IMO. But your words are colored by the differing lenses of perception through which you are
seeing, and then, interpreting. We all do this, I believe, on both personal and cultural levels, especially in regard to those things which are difficult to express in words.
I sense this, too, but I differ from you dans, in that I don't see/feel this as something necessarily 'foreign.' We hold within us both light and darkness, in my understanding. This
thing, as I perceive it, emanates from within ourselves, not from some outside source.
What you've described here: "reaching too quickly for something it wanted to take from us," and "it
wants, it
hungers" are behaviors common to children. This
thing has not yet reached its maturity. But what we feed, grows. It is more a matter of what we choose, on a collective level, to feed.
To address Linnea's initial question:
Is there a 'lust for power' that is natural to us? Seems that is a driving force behind most of what is being 'designed'. This lust for power seems even beyond 'human nature' - at least in its current 'death wish' kinds of patterning.
This is not to say that I feel we are damned by an inherent 'lust for power' or anything of the sort. Key here are the words 'natural to us.' No, I do not believe this is natural to us. I won't go into this in great detail here, but I do not accept that humans are 'naturally' greedy, violent creatures. In simplified form: This began when we began to live in an unnatural state. We are 'naturally' egalitarian creatures, as were the original human foraging communities. But when faced with shortages of resources, we entered an 'unnatural' state, and adapted to that reality. We cannot now undo what's been done over vast ages of time, but we CAN recognize it, and work to correct the imbalance we've created.
I hope that made sense in some way, as I realize I am greatly oversimplifying something much more complicated, for the sake of brevity.
I also realize that my view goes against the more commonly held view of 'human nature,' but it is, nonetheless, my view, and is based in my own research, observations, and thought processes. I do not wish to argue it. I merely put it forth as a part of our discussion, to be considered, and understood as my view when I speak.
dansgold wrote:
But I won't run.
Nor will I, dans. My act of 'running' is actually a battle stance, although again, not in a conventional sense.
I hope that we, here, will be tolerant of one another, and that none of us have come here with intent to debate or argue, but to share our thoughts and toss out ideas in a search for meaning in the face of that which, for all practical purposes, is ineffable.