Part One must be declared 'inclusive', pending future information
Early reports ... nerve agent found at a chemical-weapons 'training facility' West of Baghdad.
If so ...
12 years of inspections ... failed.
stay tuned ...
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-- dansgold
The avalanche has started, it is too late for the pebbles to vote.
Failure of Inspections ... Part Two ... Chemicals
Moderator: Super Moderators
Failure of Inspections ... Part Two ... Chemicals
-- dansgold
The avalanche has started, it is too late for the pebbles to vote.
The avalanche has started, it is too late for the pebbles to vote.
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CindyLouWho
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alaskandevil
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The last I read on this was that they had found a small "sample" of Taubun. This is a nerve gas which would make it a WMD although it was only a small amount. All it takes tho is a drop of this on your skin to kill you so where do you draw the line?
Enough to kill 100 people? 1000 people? 10,000 people?
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"FAILURE IS NOT AN OPTION. It comes bundled with the software."
Enough to kill 100 people? 1000 people? 10,000 people?
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"FAILURE IS NOT AN OPTION. It comes bundled with the software."
" Edited for Political Correctness "
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Devastated
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Erin Brockovich where are you?<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by alaskandevil:
The last I read on this was that they had found a small "sample" of Taubun. This is a nerve gas which would make it a WMD although it was only a small amount. All it takes tho is a drop of this on your skin to kill you so where do you draw the line?
Enough to kill 100 people? 1000 people? 10,000 people?
</font>
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Remember, these are the GOOD times.....
You don't have to believe everything that you think...
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Cherry Kelly
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There was more than just that one vial found - several small boxes containing three vials of white powder - (at time there seemed to be some argument on what those vials are) - but why would they have just three per box and several boxes? Also the jars with the yellow labels have proven to be other chemicals which when combined are also chemically related to the types used in chem warfare.
Late last night/early morning a quick news item flashed across screen about yet another find of chems in Baghdad - am waiting more info on that one - was small cache, but paperwork was also found - to indicate removing larger amounts...
Late last night/early morning a quick news item flashed across screen about yet another find of chems in Baghdad - am waiting more info on that one - was small cache, but paperwork was also found - to indicate removing larger amounts...
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CindyLouWho
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Can anyone support what you folks are posting? I've seen nothing on this. I did read where a large cache of weapons was found and that some of the war heads had "fillers" ... but nothing inside.
What am I missing? Please share!
Cindy
p.s. I find the fact that we found this HUGE amount of weapons very peculiar. Why in the world would any military just leave that? They must think they have enough in Baghdad to cover their arses. Very strange. Hope its not some sort of set-up.
What am I missing? Please share!
Cindy
p.s. I find the fact that we found this HUGE amount of weapons very peculiar. Why in the world would any military just leave that? They must think they have enough in Baghdad to cover their arses. Very strange. Hope its not some sort of set-up.
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Cherry Kelly
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CIndy -- I read an original article linked from Drudge to a newspaper about the chems found in the former training facility. There was also pictures shown on most of the major news shows (FOX, CNN and NBC - at least those three) of some of the "bottles with yellow labels" and "box with vials" - also a stack of more of these boxes (stated as having same).
Am attempting to locate link again - but having some difficulties opening news web sites this morning. (4-6)
It was also stated (tv news) that ricin has also been found in the caches ... tests were being gone to see if it was same formula as ricin found in the Paris subway.
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As for all the weapons - caches - abandoned - I believe that when you consider that the armies of Saddam are NOT loyal but are comprised of more "rag-tag" groups, it is fairly easy to understand. They simply do not want to die and when faced with that - they run away.
It was stated some time ago that many of the conscripts of Saddam - have their families threatened - YOU will fight or we will kill - spouse, children - etc. Leaving all military stuff and donning civilian clothes -- they can appear as ordinary people who are just in process of fleeing the "evil war".
Am attempting to locate link again - but having some difficulties opening news web sites this morning. (4-6)
It was also stated (tv news) that ricin has also been found in the caches ... tests were being gone to see if it was same formula as ricin found in the Paris subway.
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As for all the weapons - caches - abandoned - I believe that when you consider that the armies of Saddam are NOT loyal but are comprised of more "rag-tag" groups, it is fairly easy to understand. They simply do not want to die and when faced with that - they run away.
It was stated some time ago that many of the conscripts of Saddam - have their families threatened - YOU will fight or we will kill - spouse, children - etc. Leaving all military stuff and donning civilian clothes -- they can appear as ordinary people who are just in process of fleeing the "evil war".
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CindyLouWho
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Cherry Kelly
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Cindy -- dunno how soon the reports will hit internet news sources. Two items came off cband sat news: One was small building at the airport (troops finally got to inspect) several soldiers became ill shortly after inspection with symptoms common to exposure to nerve gas. They were calling in special chem units to do a more thorough inspection.
Other news today was about a cache found in a city south of Baghdad. Still waiting more info on that one.
Other news today was about a cache found in a city south of Baghdad. Still waiting more info on that one.
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alaskandevil
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Here are a few I found doing a search of various sites.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,83449,00.html
Pentagon sources said a prisoner of war led U.S. forces to a specific site near Karbala, near a camp described as a military facility, and that preliminary field tests on substances found at the site suggest they contain several banned chemical weapons, including deadly nerve agents.
http://www.msnbc.com/news/895392_asp.htm
April 7 — The U.S. military is testing samples from a site in Iraq where soldiers found possible chemical weapons, defense officials said Monday. Embedded journalists in Iraq reported instances where banned weaponry was found, including on some 20 rockets armed with warheads containing deadly sarin and mustard gas that were apparently ready to fire.
Reporter Tom Lasseter said initial tests of samples from the facility were inconsistent. Some tests did not indicate chemical weapons, while others indicated the presence of G-class nerve agents — which include sarin and tabun — and mustard agent, a blistering chemical first used in World War I.
He also reported that he and several soldiers were decontaminated after some of the soldiers felt ill while searching the compound. Officials at the Pentagon said they did not have any information about anyone getting sick.
NBC’s Dana Lewis reported from near Karbala that U.S. Army commanders said they have discovered more than a dozen barrels of chemicals in an agricultural facility 30 miles northeast of there that have tested positive as blister and nerve agents.
National Public Radio reporter John Burnett said officers of the U.S. 1st Marine Division told him warheads had been found south of Baghdad in a warehouse near Baghdad International Airport, seized last week by coalition forces.
The officers told him the warheads were on Iraqi BM-21 unguided rockets. Those rockets are about 10 feet long, with a range of approximately 15 miles. The BM-21 is a 40-year-old truck-mounted system with 40 rocket tubes, intended for close support of troops.
The Wall Street Journal reported that U.S. military officers had told troops that soldiers from the 101st Airborne Division had captured an Iraqi BMP Armored Personnel Carrier that was believed to contain sarin gas and mustard gas.
That information was issued over the military secure radio network, according to several Marine officials who heard the broadcast at about 11 a.m. local time.
NBC’s Lewis reported that U.S. commanders were led to the agriculture facility by an Iraqi.
As they were searching through the agricultural facility they discovered literature on controlling mosquitoes. But in a nearby pit camouflaged with leaves they found eleven 25-gallon barrels and three 55-gallon barrels.
Those tests also were positive for GA, known as tabun, GB, also known as sarin, both nerve agents, and for lewisite, a blister agent. But further testing is under way.
http://www.msnbc.com/news/895185_asp.htm
Positive test for terror toxins in Iraq
Evidence of ricin, botulinum at Islamic militants’ camp
Preliminary tests conducted by MSNBC.com indicate that the deadly toxins ricin and botulinum were present on two items found at a camp in a remote mountain region of northern Iraq allegedly used as a terrorist training center by Islamic militants with ties to the al-Qaida terrorist network. The field tests used by MSNBC.com are only a first step in the evidentiary process and are typically followed by more precise laboratory testing that MSNBC.com has not conducted. MSNBC.COM CONDUCTED the tests over a two-day period at Sargat, an alleged terrorist training camp a mile from the Iraq-Iran border. MSNBC.com purchased the test kits commercially. The field tests, developed by Osborn Scientific Group in Lakeside, Ariz., are regarded by some experts as very effective and have been used by U.N. weapons inspectors and federal government agents around the Sept. 11, 2001, attack site in New York City.
The Sargat camp, set back in an isolated valley and surrounded by snow-capped peaks, was home to the radical Islamic militant group Ansar al-Islam, which counts among its some 700 followers scores of al-Qaida fighters.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle ... 919645.stm
Nerve agent
In a separate development, US military spokesman Vincent Brooks said troops in the western desert had found what they suspected was a training school for nuclear, chemical and biological warfare.
One bottle found at the site was labelled "tabun" - a nerve agent that the US Government says may have been used during the 1980-88 Iran-Iraq war.
"In that particular site, we believe that was the only sample," Brooks said.
"That's why we believe it was a training site
Photos of the site showed shelves of brown bottles with yellow labels. Brooks said troops did not understand some of the labels and were collecting the bottles for examination by experts.
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"FAILURE IS NOT AN OPTION. It comes bundled with the software."
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,83449,00.html
Pentagon sources said a prisoner of war led U.S. forces to a specific site near Karbala, near a camp described as a military facility, and that preliminary field tests on substances found at the site suggest they contain several banned chemical weapons, including deadly nerve agents.
http://www.msnbc.com/news/895392_asp.htm
April 7 — The U.S. military is testing samples from a site in Iraq where soldiers found possible chemical weapons, defense officials said Monday. Embedded journalists in Iraq reported instances where banned weaponry was found, including on some 20 rockets armed with warheads containing deadly sarin and mustard gas that were apparently ready to fire.
Reporter Tom Lasseter said initial tests of samples from the facility were inconsistent. Some tests did not indicate chemical weapons, while others indicated the presence of G-class nerve agents — which include sarin and tabun — and mustard agent, a blistering chemical first used in World War I.
He also reported that he and several soldiers were decontaminated after some of the soldiers felt ill while searching the compound. Officials at the Pentagon said they did not have any information about anyone getting sick.
NBC’s Dana Lewis reported from near Karbala that U.S. Army commanders said they have discovered more than a dozen barrels of chemicals in an agricultural facility 30 miles northeast of there that have tested positive as blister and nerve agents.
National Public Radio reporter John Burnett said officers of the U.S. 1st Marine Division told him warheads had been found south of Baghdad in a warehouse near Baghdad International Airport, seized last week by coalition forces.
The officers told him the warheads were on Iraqi BM-21 unguided rockets. Those rockets are about 10 feet long, with a range of approximately 15 miles. The BM-21 is a 40-year-old truck-mounted system with 40 rocket tubes, intended for close support of troops.
The Wall Street Journal reported that U.S. military officers had told troops that soldiers from the 101st Airborne Division had captured an Iraqi BMP Armored Personnel Carrier that was believed to contain sarin gas and mustard gas.
That information was issued over the military secure radio network, according to several Marine officials who heard the broadcast at about 11 a.m. local time.
NBC’s Lewis reported that U.S. commanders were led to the agriculture facility by an Iraqi.
As they were searching through the agricultural facility they discovered literature on controlling mosquitoes. But in a nearby pit camouflaged with leaves they found eleven 25-gallon barrels and three 55-gallon barrels.
Those tests also were positive for GA, known as tabun, GB, also known as sarin, both nerve agents, and for lewisite, a blister agent. But further testing is under way.
http://www.msnbc.com/news/895185_asp.htm
Positive test for terror toxins in Iraq
Evidence of ricin, botulinum at Islamic militants’ camp
Preliminary tests conducted by MSNBC.com indicate that the deadly toxins ricin and botulinum were present on two items found at a camp in a remote mountain region of northern Iraq allegedly used as a terrorist training center by Islamic militants with ties to the al-Qaida terrorist network. The field tests used by MSNBC.com are only a first step in the evidentiary process and are typically followed by more precise laboratory testing that MSNBC.com has not conducted. MSNBC.COM CONDUCTED the tests over a two-day period at Sargat, an alleged terrorist training camp a mile from the Iraq-Iran border. MSNBC.com purchased the test kits commercially. The field tests, developed by Osborn Scientific Group in Lakeside, Ariz., are regarded by some experts as very effective and have been used by U.N. weapons inspectors and federal government agents around the Sept. 11, 2001, attack site in New York City.
The Sargat camp, set back in an isolated valley and surrounded by snow-capped peaks, was home to the radical Islamic militant group Ansar al-Islam, which counts among its some 700 followers scores of al-Qaida fighters.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle ... 919645.stm
Nerve agent
In a separate development, US military spokesman Vincent Brooks said troops in the western desert had found what they suspected was a training school for nuclear, chemical and biological warfare.
One bottle found at the site was labelled "tabun" - a nerve agent that the US Government says may have been used during the 1980-88 Iran-Iraq war.
"In that particular site, we believe that was the only sample," Brooks said.
"That's why we believe it was a training site
Photos of the site showed shelves of brown bottles with yellow labels. Brooks said troops did not understand some of the labels and were collecting the bottles for examination by experts.
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"FAILURE IS NOT AN OPTION. It comes bundled with the software."
" Edited for Political Correctness "
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eliza_nightvoice
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"Smoking gun" WMD site in Iraq turns out to contain pesticide
A facility near Baghdad that a US officer had claimed might finally be "smoking gun" evidence of Iraqi chemical weapons production turned out to containpesticide, not sarin gas as originally thought.
A military intelligence officer for the US 101st Airborne Division's aviation brigade, Captain Adam Mastrianni, told AFP that comprehensive tests Monday determined the presence of the pesticide compounds.
Initial tests had reportedly detected traces of sarin -- a powerful toxin that quickly affects the nervous system -- after US soldiers guarding the facility near
Hindiyah, 100 kilometres (60 miles) south of Baghdad, became ill.
Article
So we are starting to find out the UN weapons inspectors were not finding anything. There wasn't anything to find. So where was / is
the "big danger" to the American people? Or maybe a better question is were we ever in danger? This wan a very expensive action in
terms of lives lost and money needed to conduct it. The economy is still faltering; more people are out of work and the debt has
sky-rocketed. And we still have 2 more nations on the list of the "evil axis." I wonder what pesticides they are using?
A facility near Baghdad that a US officer had claimed might finally be "smoking gun" evidence of Iraqi chemical weapons production turned out to containpesticide, not sarin gas as originally thought.
A military intelligence officer for the US 101st Airborne Division's aviation brigade, Captain Adam Mastrianni, told AFP that comprehensive tests Monday determined the presence of the pesticide compounds.
Initial tests had reportedly detected traces of sarin -- a powerful toxin that quickly affects the nervous system -- after US soldiers guarding the facility near
Hindiyah, 100 kilometres (60 miles) south of Baghdad, became ill.
Article
So we are starting to find out the UN weapons inspectors were not finding anything. There wasn't anything to find. So where was / is
the "big danger" to the American people? Or maybe a better question is were we ever in danger? This wan a very expensive action in
terms of lives lost and money needed to conduct it. The economy is still faltering; more people are out of work and the debt has
sky-rocketed. And we still have 2 more nations on the list of the "evil axis." I wonder what pesticides they are using?
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Cherry Kelly
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nightvoice -- there seem to be several conflicting reports for sure.
Biggest question one has to ask - would pesticides be buried and covered with camophlage covering? (as shown regarding some of the barrels found at one of the sites).
What is the chemical composition of the "pesticide"? And are they positive that those barrels ONLY contained pesticide?
Going back to prior wars where packets of stuff were hidden inside of other barrels - barrels that contained other liquids, yet hidden inside were other packages that contained different things - different chems.
- - -
Remember how many times our coast guard people have found coffee - with heroine inside? What makes anyone think that the barrels here could not be "similarly" props for far more deadly stuff?
Biggest question one has to ask - would pesticides be buried and covered with camophlage covering? (as shown regarding some of the barrels found at one of the sites).
What is the chemical composition of the "pesticide"? And are they positive that those barrels ONLY contained pesticide?
Going back to prior wars where packets of stuff were hidden inside of other barrels - barrels that contained other liquids, yet hidden inside were other packages that contained different things - different chems.
- - -
Remember how many times our coast guard people have found coffee - with heroine inside? What makes anyone think that the barrels here could not be "similarly" props for far more deadly stuff?
What makes you think its in Iraq?
Why not a ship out of Malta?
You got to think out of the box!
A ship sailing on the waters, with all the
chemicals, Suddam has aquired.
Think out of the box!
Why not a ship out of Malta?
You got to think out of the box!
A ship sailing on the waters, with all the
chemicals, Suddam has aquired.
Think out of the box!
“There are only two ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle.
The other is as though everything is a miracle." ~ Albert Einstein ~
The other is as though everything is a miracle." ~ Albert Einstein ~
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eliza_nightvoice
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The first "biggest question" I 'd like to ask is were the barrels covered when they were first discovered? Or, like those boxes used as a background for a presidential speech that had the labels "Made in USA" covering the "Made in China" stamps, was this a photo op operation. Had to make those barrels look goo for the war to destroy all those WMD they haven't found yet.<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Cherry Kelly:
Biggest question one has to ask - would pesticides be buried and covered with camophlage covering? (as shown regarding some of the barrels found at one of the sites).
</font>