Fox calls OBL death "illegal"

kbot · Post by **kbot** » 05-04-2011 12:39 PM

Attached is a short article and video clip from the Huffington Post, describing Fox News' Shep Smith's and Judge Napolitano's take on the recent Navy SEALS' attempted capture of bin Laden, and his subsequent death. In their view, the act was illegal.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/05/0 ... 57356.html

I wonder if, when Bush 43, stated that he wanted OBL taken either dead or alive, if either of these individuals rushed to caution Bush that what he was advocating was "illegal". What part of OBL and followers commited an act of war on this country don't these dolts quite grasp???????

Would they have had the same point of view if the Bush WH didn't let OBL go at Tora Bora, and instead either captured or killed him? This (capture or killing OBL) has been the government's stated and publicized goal since it was determined that he was behind the 9/11 (and other attacks). Fox News gleefully exploited this fact for nearly ten years now. Is Fox now throwing the 9/11 victims under the proverbial bus?

While another debate is firing-up across the country - release the pictures of a dead OBL or not, does Fox News new persepctive only add fuel to the alleged hurt feelings of the Islamic world, namely, that the US Government engaged in "illegal" tactics in going after and killing OBL? Is Fox now siding with terrorists?

rumike · Post by **rumike** » 05-04-2011 01:50 PM

By using fear as the means to their political ends, Fox has not only been siding with terrorists - Fox is a terrorist organization. That's what terrorists do. Instill fear.

kbot · Post by **kbot** » 05-05-2011 09:21 AM

rumike wrote: By using fear as the means to their political ends, Fox has not only been siding with terrorists - Fox is a terrorist organization. That's what terrorists do. Instill fear.

I have found over the years that fear takes-up a lot of space in the Right's toolkit. These are the most easily frightened people on the face of the planet. "Something" (whatever that may be) "might happen". Some sheik in the Middle East catches a cold, the price of oil goes up - driven up by speculators. Not that the actual price of oil HAS gone up, or supply has gone down, or supply has gone up. No, someone on Wall St thinks that in their esteemed opinion, "something might happen". Well, we just saw proof of this earlier this morning on CSPAN when in the House, it was mentioned that, while demand is down and supply is up, the cost at the pump is also, mind-bongingly, UP. Why is that? Wall St speculators (and, even the GOP admits to this) have driven the price of gasoline up. It's not the lack of domestic drilling. It's not the supply and demand. It's Wall St, GOP-protected greed, pour and simple. Because of the fear-induced haze these people live with, we are all suffering, whether it's the cost for fuel, or all the related and indirect costs such as food, etc. These people need to grow up, get beyond the "There's a boogeyman under the bed"/ Nursery rhyme stage and move on.

My personal opinion is that it's time to take a second look at nationalizing the oil and gas industry in this country. As the commercial running on cable tv shows (put out by the oil and gas industry, btw) "2/3rds of all oil and gas comes from North America". That being the case, then, this is just a case of industry greed and mismanagement. If the oil and gas is already here - as natural resources, we the tax payers already own it. If the oil and gas suppliers cannot do the job in a cost effective manner (they are recording record-breaking profits all the time), then maybe it's time to take back our natural resources from the oil and gas businesses in the "interests of national security", and take it all out of the hands of Wall St. speculators who's only role in this is to drive up the final cost

Wanna see prices drop quickly???????

Cherry Kelly · Post by **Cherry Kelly** » 05-05-2011 01:36 PM

I do not trust huffington posts - for the simple reason that they are often one sided and wrong. They take clips and expound on those as if it was the whole story....

(could be part of the reason they are being sued - maybe?)

However, all media plays on the FEAR factor. Whether on tv or internet news. Sad to say its not just one singular party or media.

Saharaka · Post by **Saharaka** » 05-05-2011 05:01 PM

rumike wrote: By using fear as the means to their political ends, Fox has not only been siding with terrorists - Fox is a terrorist organization. That's what terrorists do. Instill fear.

Well said Mike.

kbot · Post by **kbot** » 05-05-2011 06:20 PM

Cherry Kelly wrote: I do not trust huffington posts - for the simple reason that they are often one sided and wrong. They take clips and expound on those as if it was the whole story....

(could be part of the reason they are being sued - maybe?)

However, all media plays on the FEAR factor. Whether on tv or internet news. Sad to say its not just one singular party or media.

Could be...but even Fox News and the GOP now admit that oil and gas prices have risen to the extent that they have because of Wall St speculators. So, this is not a strictly economic (supply vs demand) issue. This is a pure greed issue.

In this day and age of record profits gained through extracting and refining what are, truly, our own country's natural resources, we need to stop and ask ourselves the question - can't this be done in a better way? "Better" being defined as more cost effective to the American people. These resources belong to ALL of us, and the profits shouldn't go to the oil and gas companies. If anything, a portion should go towards paying down the debt - and Wall St should be taken out of the equation. Just MHO.....

Bobbi Snow · Post by **Bobbi Snow** » 05-06-2011 12:24 AM

Armed or not... by killing him, we didn't have to bring him back to Gitmo or the U.S. to stand trial. We didn't have to Mirandize him, we don't have to put our tax dollars towards a costly trial and a lot of unnecessary hooplah - not to mention the possible attempts from sympathizers to break him out from wherever he would have been held, or insidious bombings triggered by his capture.

He didn't just kill Americans, and travelers; he killed lots of his own people in the Middle East. He incited Sharia Law and caused many women to be beat, to starve, and to be forced to do horrible things to survive their husbands and the Laws by which their women were forced to live.

I'm glad he's gone.

Iris · Post by **Iris** » 05-06-2011 02:40 AM

It's really sad when Republicans are so bent on discrediting our President they will side with dictators, murderers, and terrorists to accomplish their political aims. They should be ashamed.

kbot · Post by **kbot** » 05-06-2011 09:03 AM

Bobbi Snow wrote: Armed or not... by killing him, we didn't have to bring him back to Gitmo or the U.S. to stand trial. We didn't have to Mirandize him, we don't have to put our tax dollars towards a costly trial and a lot of unnecessary hooplah - not to mention the possible attempts from sympathizers to break him out from wherever he would have been held, or insidious bombings triggered by his capture.

He didn't just kill Americans, and travelers; he killed lots of his own people in the Middle East. He incited Sharia Law and caused many women to be beat, to starve, and to be forced to do horrible things to survive their husbands and the Laws by which their women were forced to live.

I'm glad he's gone.

The one thought that keeps coming to my mind since this occured, is the picture of Mussolini and his mistress hanging in public for everyone to see. While I applaud the president's decision and the actins of the SEALS and CIA, I am at a loss to rationalize the president's decision to not allow the pictures to be viewed. I think that this would hearten those who were hurt by bin Laden. His supporters are upset with us already....

kbot · Post by **kbot** » 05-06-2011 09:05 AM

Iris wrote: It's really sad when Republicans are so bent on discrediting our President they will side with dictators, murderers, and terrorists to accomplish their political aims. They should be ashamed.

Flip-flopping like a fish on a dock. When Bush was going after him, they supported him. President Obama followed Bush's same views and policies. The fact that Fox is speaking out the way they are just reinforced the view that they are a bunch of tools for the Right.

Raggedyann · Post by **Raggedyann** » 05-06-2011 10:58 AM

kbot wrote: I am at a loss to rationalize the president's decision to not allow the pictures to be viewed.

They used to hang the heads of treasonous criminals at the Tower Of London for full viewing after they had slaughtered them. Do we not look back upon this as being bloody thirsty, uncivilized and overly vengeful? Have we not progressed?

kbot · Post by **kbot** » 05-06-2011 12:23 PM

Raggedyann wrote: They used to hang the heads of treasonous criminals at the Tower Of London for full viewing after they had slaughtered them. Do we not look back upon this as being bloody thirsty, uncivilized and overly vengeful? Have we not progressed?

Perhaps ypour right. But, that being said, survivors of victims in capital crimes here in the USA are allowed by law to witness executions.

Also, I seem to recall Americans hanging from a bridge in Iraq being broadcast across the Arab world, not to mention a number of videos of captured victims being decapitated being broadcast around the globe ad nauseum. Apparently, visual impact is what radical Muslims respond to.

And, a major difference here between what's occured in England with the Crown, and bin Laden. He declared war on us and attacked us.

Now, that bieng said, would I rush to view the pictures? Probably not. But, at the same time, there are thousands of Americans and foreigners out there who's lives were destroyed by this madman, and I wouldn't want to be the individual responsible for denying them a sense of closure.

Raggedyann · Post by **Raggedyann** » 05-06-2011 12:49 PM

kbot wrote: Perhaps ypour right. But, that being said, survivors of victims in capital crimes here in the USA are allowed by law to witness executions.

Also, I seem to recall Americans hanging from a bridge in Iraq being broadcast across the Arab world, not to mention a number of videos of captured victims being decapitated being broadcast around the globe ad nauseum. Apparently, visual impact is what radical Muslims respond to.

And, a major difference here between what's occured in England with the Crown, and bin Laden. He declared war on us and attacked us.

Now, that bieng said, would I rush to view the pictures? Probably not. But, at the same time, there are thousands of Americans and foreigners out there who's lives were destroyed by this madman, and I wouldn't want to be the individual responsible for denying them a sense of closure.

Executions are witnessed by family etc. They are not televised for public viewing pleasure. Perhaps the family of the 9/11 victims should be given the option but I don't see why the entire world needs to view gruesome pictures to get a sense of closure. The fact that Muslims around the globe participate in killing circus shows, doesn't make it moral or civilized for us to do it. Look how outraged we become when Muslims stand and cheer at our downfalls or show 'faces blown off' pictures on the net? I would like to think we are above tit for tat.

kbot · Post by **kbot** » 05-06-2011 01:20 PM

Raggedyann wrote: Executions are witnessed by family etc. They are not televised for public viewing pleasure. Perhaps the family of the 9/11 victims should be given the option but I don't see why the entire world needs to view gruesome pictures to get a sense of closure. The fact that Muslims around the globe participate in killing circus shows, doesn't make it moral or civilized. Look how outraged we become when Muslims stand and cheer at our downfalls or show 'faces blown off' pictures on the net? I would like to think we are above tit for tat.

Well, as I said, I wouldn't be one rushing to view the pictures. By the same token, I wouldn't want to be the one to unilaterally decide that the surviving victims, family members, fire fighters, police, military members and their families, as well as foreigners who's lives have been destroyed have no right to view the end of this man (using the word very loosely). There were millions of people other than those right there at the WTC who have suffered. I don't look on this as a circus show, but am thinking more back to the spirit of the Nuremberg Trials and the - even now, current prosecutions of Nazi war criminals. We're not talking about misdemeanor crimes here, but crimes against humanity. This rises to a much higher level. I'm not saying that people need to have a gun put to their head and be forced to view these pictures. That would be their choice. But, again, by the same token, I firmly believe that if our government is demanding that ourt military use all of their resources to catch this man (?) and place their lives on hold, and that, given we already have a history of displaying pictures of other dead terrorists, then, really, what is the issue here with this individual? The terrorists and upset with us already, and personally, I really don't care what they think.......they attacked us, after all.

Iris · Post by **Iris** » 05-06-2011 04:42 PM

kbot wrote: Flip-flopping like a fish on a dock. When Bush was going after him, they supported him. President Obama followed Bush's same views and policies. The fact that Fox is speaking out the way they are just reinforced the view that they are a bunch of tools for the Right.

Good point, Kbot. Obama accomplished in two years what Bush did not accomplish in eight. The GOP bragged that only Republicans can keep us safe, when the opposite has been proven true over and over, and now once again.

kbot wrote: ... I am at a loss to rationalize the president's decision to not allow the pictures to be viewed...

Here's another way to look at it. If you are clear that you're for peace, you can use that as a yardstick to measure any action. Does it support peace, or support more war? Airing these particular photos would support more war, more human suffering and death. I'm against that.

For what? The deathers would just say the pictures are photoshopped. Causing more suffering for that is unconscionable, IMO.

It's good enough for me that Congress is being shown the proof, and Al Qaeda has admitted OBL was killed by our military.

It's good to know that wicked evil man will never again hurt another person.

In my opinion, President Obama has taken the high road in refusing to share the photos with the public at large. Only bad could come of showing them.