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HB3
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Post by HB3 » 12-21-2013 03:02 PM

Poll: Obama Popularity Plunges in Obamacare Wake
Obama distrusted on all issues but terrorism, poll shows

President Barack Obama is distrusted by more than 50 percent of Americans, a first-ever find in a Quinniapac University poll.

Approval for President Barack Obama continues to sink in the eyes of Americans, with another poll showing his popularity at an all-time low, following his administration's rocky rollout of the Affordable Care Act and overall disgust with government officials.

About 54 percent of Americans disapprove of Obama versus 39 percent who approve, according to a Quinnipiac University survey released Tuesday. That compares with a similar poll released Oct. 1 when 49 percent disapproved of Obama compared to 45 percent who approved.

"Like all new presidents, President Barack Obama had a honeymoon with American voters, with approval ratings in the high 50s. As the marriage wore on, he kept his job approval scores in the respectable, though not overwhelming, 40s. Today, for the first time it appears that 40 percent floor is cracking," said Tim Malloy, assistant director of the Quinnipiac University Polling Institute in a memo accompanying the poll results.

For the first time in a Quinnipiac poll, Obama is distrusted by the majority of Americans, with 52 percent saying he is not honest and trustworthy compared to 44 percent who say he is.

"Any Democrat with an 11-point approval deficit among women is in trouble and any elected official with an 8-point trust deficit [overall] is in serious trouble," he added.

The only issue on which a majority of Americans approve of Obama is terrorism at 52 percent approval and 42 percent disapproval. The president received less than 40 percent approval on his handling of the economy, health care, foreign policy, immigration and the budget.

The poll also showed the widespread public apprehension over the president's health care law. Just 19 percent of voters say they think their health care quality will improve next year as a result of Obamacare, while 43 percent say it will get worse. About 33 percent say they don't think it will affect their health care. Overall, 55 percent say they oppose the new law, compared to 39 percent who approve of it.

"President Obama's misstatement, 'If you like your health plan, you can keep it,' left a bad taste with a lot of people," Malloy said. "Nearly half of the voters, 46 percent, think he knowingly deceived them."
http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/201 ... acare-wake

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Post by Cherry Kelly » 12-21-2013 03:21 PM

strindl --
YOU claimed you have the same insurance and hospital as before you signed up. THEREFORE -- YOU did not even NEED to sign up at all. YOU could have gone straight to your insurance company for any new requirements.

NEWS about ACA being a demand or pay a fine is all over numerous internet web sites....but YOU deny it.

YOU still have NOT answered if you even READ the original bill that became law. AND YOU are one that FALSELY claimed that I said 18000 ADDITIONAL pages were 'original law' -- when I have REPEATEDLY said around 2K original and the other pages came AFTERWARD!!!

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Post by kbot » 12-22-2013 08:24 AM

Cherry Kelly wrote: strindl --
YOU claimed you have the same insurance and hospital as before you signed up. THEREFORE -- YOU did not even NEED to sign up at all. YOU could have gone straight to your insurance company for any new requirements.

NEWS about ACA being a demand or pay a fine is all over numerous internet web sites....but YOU deny it.

YOU still have NOT answered if you even READ the original bill that became law. AND YOU are one that FALSELY claimed that I said 18000 ADDITIONAL pages were 'original law' -- when I have REPEATEDLY said around 2K original and the other pages came AFTERWARD!!!


Obama has said quite a few times that he modeled his plan on Romney's plan. Here is Massachusetts, we are REQUIRED under Massachusetts law to provide documentation from the insurance company that we have a policy with when we file our state taxes. If we don't have the document from the insurance company, we pay a fine. It's that simple.

And, expanding this on a national level, this is why Obama enlisted the IRS.

This is a logical extension of Romney's plan in Massachusetts, and I believe that this is how Obama characterized this element of his plan - you have insurance, you're OK. If you don't you pay a fine.

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Post by kbot » 12-22-2013 08:26 AM

[quote="HB3 "For the first time in a Quinnipiac poll, Obama is distrusted by the majority of Americans, with 52 percent saying he is not honest and trustworthy compared to 44 percent who say he is.""]
http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/201 ... acare-wake [/quote]

I'm astounded by the droves of the young people moving away from Obama the way they have been. I'm sure they're feeling used right about now.....

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Post by voguy » 12-22-2013 11:53 AM

kbot wrote: I'm astounded by the droves of the young people moving away from Obama the way they have been. I'm sure they're feeling used right about now.....


They should, because they are. Not only for their money, but to harm other people.
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them." - Thomas Jefferson

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Post by kbot » 12-22-2013 12:47 PM

Should make the 2016 race interesting.

2014 is the first year of Obamacare. 2015 is the first years that insurers adjust their premiums under Obamacare. If the younger people don't enroll in the numbers Obama and his team hoped for, then there will be spikes.

Young people who don't enroll, and are not on another plan - such as their parents or through an employer - will get wacked with a non-participation tax courtesy of the IRS.

In addition to having their student loan interest rates climbing......

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Post by strindl » 12-22-2013 12:54 PM

Cherry Kelly wrote: strindl --
YOU claimed you have the same insurance and hospital as before you signed up. THEREFORE -- YOU did not even NEED to sign up at all. YOU could have gone straight to your insurance company for any new requirements.


Go back and read what I posted again. Like maybe even the original post that began this thread with the Wall Street Journal piece where I was interviewed by the reporter. Since I had health issues in 2009, and my private health insurance company I had been with for over a decade decided to cancel my policy, I had been shut out of the private insurance market. I had been able to get coverage ONLY because of a decades old program set up by the State of Wisconsin called HIRSP. That program is going away, but because of Obama Care, I once again have access to the private health insurance market.

Keeping my existing insurance through HIRSP was not an option. I went onto the healthcare.gov website and looked through the many many options available to me and chose one that included my current doctors and hospital in their network.

Because of Obamacare, no American can ever have their health insurance canceled because they get sick ever again. And no American can ever be denied coverage because of a pre existing condition.

So, yes I did need to sign up , and yes I did require the changes made by Obamacare to even qualify to buy private health insurance.

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Post by kbot » 12-22-2013 01:36 PM

Political Chinese fire drill????

The Insiders: Is Obamacare shattering?

The White House is bending, extending, changing and reinterpreting the Obamacare rules on the fly. Last night, the administration announced “at least the 14th unilateral change to Obamacare that’s been made without consulting Congress.” There is no reason to believe that more changes aren’t coming. This latest change states that Americans who have had the health-care plans they liked and wanted to keep canceled can either buy “bare-bones” coverage (of course no one knows what that means) or no coverage at all for next year. This de facto exemption for what could be millions of Americans who received cancellation notices brings new worries and immense confusion for insurers and others in the health-care industry.


It doesn’t look like people are signing up for Obamacare in sufficient enough numbers to make the law work. The White House knows this, and all these sudden rule changes suggest officials are in a panic. The Democrats never expected to be in this position. Obamacare just isn’t happening.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/pos ... hattering/

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Post by Cherry Kelly » 12-22-2013 02:02 PM

kbot - we have always listed our medical insurance policy and the amount paid for well over 20 years. So as far as I'm concerned that is nothing new. Naturally only get % of that against deductions - but that's what the CPA is for.

SO why not just demand that for federal taxes. (After all there are states that have no state taxes to file.) Just require all insurance companies (including medicaid) to sent out a form to those insured that they can attach to federal tax forms. YES there are people who don't file taxes. For those on welfare, unemployed, etc. - go to their welfare (similar type) office with proof of insurance and the offices could just submit photocopy electronic information to the IRS.

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Post by Ought Six » 12-22-2013 04:33 PM

strindl:
LOL, you just can't accept the fact that I support Obamacare..BECAUSE IT"S THE RIGHT THING FOR AMERICA.
LOL! You have no answer for any of the problems with OBamacare, yet you incessantly pimp it as "RIGHT FOR AMERCIA". You simply start ignoring people when they ask questions you know you have no answer for. No problem, because I am not going away. I will keep asking until we get an answer. Let me refresh your memory....
Some of the problems with Obamacare:

-- Obamacare mandates are devastating our economy, crushing small businesses, slowing hiring, causing the slashing of employees' hours and discouraging new startups. And the effects we are seeing on business are only the very beginning of the damage.

-- Obamacare shifts a huge amount of the burden onto already-stressed state budgets in the form of unfunded Medicaid mandates for the millions of new benefit recipients that will be added to Medicaid roles. This will push many states on the edge over it into receivership, making the coming wave of such 'bankruptcies' (states cannot legally go bankrupt) into a tsunami.

-- Employers are ditching coverage for employees thanks to Obamacare. Almost none of those employees will qualify for subsidies, so they are now on their own and without health insurance. The cost of a compliant policy will be crushing for them, further exacerbating the crisis in lack of retirement savings in this nation.

-- Obamacare contains *zero* workable cost-cutting measures. Instead, it has exploded costs. Dems successfully fought to lock real, working cost-cutting measures like interstate portability, tort reform and the ability of people to form private healthcare coops out of the bill. Unsustainably expensive new benefits like long-term care were added in the face of our aging demographic and shrinking revenues; another part of the 'designed to fail' Hegelian dialectic. Those exploding healthcare costs are already the primary source of personal bankruptcies in America, but we have not seen anything yet.

-- Even supporters say that Obamacare will fail if younger, healthier people refuse to sign up. The fines are inadequate to compel compliance, as they are far less than the cost of a compliant policy, so Obamacare must therefore fail (as it was designed to).

-- Doctors are fleeing the system in droves, creating another crisis on the provider side right at the moment demand for services is about to explode as the poor, indigent and people with preexisting conditions suddenly are dumped into the system. It is so bad that we are not talking just about long wait times, but about a whole lot of people simply being unable to get access to a doctor anywhere but an emergency room. And as bad as the problem is now Obamacare will make it steadily worse as they pursue their strategy of further squeezing provider payments while doing nothing to control provider costs; another way to insure the collapse of the system and create the necessary crisis to implement the single payer system they really wanted all along.

-- Insurance companies are walking away from entire states because of Obamacare mandates. We were promised more choices. The reality is that with new plan qualification restrictions and fewer companies offering plans are choices will be dramatically reduced.

-- The working poor are being positively raped by Obamacare. They make too much to qualify for subsidies but cannot possibly afford expensive Obamacare-compliant insurance plans. Their lot will be to go without health insurance and pay the fine. The taxes and other revenue mechanisms provide a minor share. The real funding is from the fines. We will largely fund Obamacare out of their wallets of those who can least afford it while those folks and their families still get no healthcare.

-- Obamacare slashed both Medicare and Medicare Advantage funding while expecting to dump 17 million more people onto Medicare roles. This obviously will quickly lead to a Medicare funding crisis; yet another facet of the Hegelian dialectic.

The Hegelian dialectic I referred to is as follows.... Create a healthcare scheme that cannot possibly work; that is designed to implode. Get the plan passed into law. As the plan starts to collapse, step forward as the 'savior' with 'the solution'; the single payer plan that was the goal from the beginning. One-sixth of our entire GDP would then suddenly be diverted through government coffers.
Interesting you just stated that single payer is, in fact, the true goal. Interesting that you state Obamacare is wonderful, then in the same breath say that when Americans see the light they will drop Obamacame like a bad case of syphilis and flock to a single-payer system. Your message is self-contradictory. You steadfastly refuse to even acknowledge much less address the glaring and unfixable problems in Obamacare while disingenuously lauding it. You are not debating honestly. Your own actions indict your own motives. You have proven yourself to be a cheap propagandist for the side you work for and nothing more.
Last edited by Ought Six on 12-22-2013 04:36 PM, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Raggedyann » 12-22-2013 05:15 PM

Ought Six wrote: You have proven yourself to be a cheap propagandist for the side you work for and nothing more.

Nobody else in this thread has pushed propaganda for their side? Too funny.
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Post by HB3 » 12-22-2013 05:17 PM

Correct -- no one else in this thread has pushed propaganda for "their side."

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Post by Diogenes » 12-22-2013 08:18 PM

Ought Six,

Post #595 - that is a fact.
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Post by Fan » 12-23-2013 10:26 AM

You are all propagandists, now get on with discussion without using cheap rhetorical devices to belittle whoever does not agree with you. It nullifies your point, no one is going to listen to you if all you do is attack the person. Come up with some actual reasons why you don't agree (and copy/pasting those reasons again and again verbatim is a waste of all of our time), then explicate.
The heartbreaking necessity of lying about reality and the heartbreaking impossibility of lying about it.

― Kurt Vonnegut, Cat's Cradle

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Post by HB3 » 12-23-2013 11:01 AM

Fan wrote: You are all propagandists.


No, we aren't, and that's an insult to the long-term posters on the site.

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